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Interview with Don McClure

CONNIE: There you are on the bow of the Titanic. Is that an iceberg ahead? Who can you tell? Will anyone give ear? Today we look at the prophet Isaiah--the man God commissioned to warn people who wouldn't listen. Giving God's trumpet a Certain Sound for more than 70 years, this is the Voice of Prophecy.

CONNIE: Hello, I'm Connie Jeffery,

LONNIE: and I'm Lonnie Melashenko. Well, Connie, you got my attention. I can picture myself on the bow of that doomed ship, peering out into the darkness, wondering whether that white shape I see ahead is a fog bank--or an iceberg. Wondering who to warn, wondering if they'll pay any attention or just keep speeding on to destruction. And you're right. The prophet Isaiah must have had a helpless feeling like that. Listen to this from chapter 6, which is part of the commission he received when God called him to be a prophet:

[The Lord] said, "'go and tell this people: "Be ever hearing, but never understanding; be ever seeing, but never perceiving." Make the heart of this people callused; make their ears dull and close their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts, and turn and be healed'" (Isa 6:9-10, NIV).

CONNIE: Wow! That sounds like a pretty discouraging job. I mean, I'm not sure I'd want to be on a radio program if part of the contract called for me to just wear people's ears out so they wouldn't listen to me anymore!

LONNIE: I'm sure Isaiah's lot was not easy. But that was true of many of the prophets that God called into His service. And as we're working our way through the books of the Bible, we've just now arrived in a new section of the Good Book: The section known as Prophets. There are 17 books in the historical section of the Old Testament, and 17 books in the Prophets section.

CONNIE: Are all these books full of prophecies about the future?

LONNIE: Actually that's a pretty common misconception about the meaning of the word prophet. In Bible times, to prophesy didn't necessarily mean to predict the future, but simply to speak a message given by someone else--usually by God.

CONNIE: So a prophet was a spokesman for God.

LONNIE: That's a good way of putting it. We call our program "The Voice of Prophecy," but we aren't always talking about predictions of the future. We use the term more broadly--our programs are based on the Bible--on the Word of God, and our mission is to bring God's Word to people.

CONNIE: To be God's "spokespeople."

LONNIE: That's right. To try to bring God's Word to our modern world and show how it applies to our daily lives. To remind people that God still cares about them and has a plan for their lives.

CONNIE: As we look at the book of Isaiah today, we recognize that prophets often had a tough mission. Isaiah lived in tough times. His message was often one of warning, but also of promise--that after a time of judgment God would bless His people. One of the people we love to talk to from time to time is Don McClure. Don and his wife Yvonne carry on a ministry to those who are literally under judgment. Men and women in prison, but like Isaiah, they're helping people find hope, even in dire circumstances. Let's listen in as David Smith speaks with Don McClure of the "Someone Cares" prison ministry.

DAVID: We are so pleased to have Don McClure from the Someone Cares Prison Ministry. We've enjoyed a real nice visit from our daily broadcast on Monday through Friday, but now on the Sunday program here you are again.

DON: Why not.

DAVID: We just appreciate so much, Don, what you and Yvonne are doing through Someone Cares. And now here on the Sunday program we are studying the fabulous Bible book of Isaiah…

DON: Great book written for prisoners.

DAVID: It really is, and as we study this book, you folks come to mind right away because you are in the business of helping to bring people freedom.

DON: Well and the Lord is so good in His kindness, and in the book of Isaiah; and I need to take a moment on just the total book of Isaiah, because when we study the Bible in prison, we dissect. We don't just read scriptures. We cut them apart, and to say to an inmate that you can be free in Jesus, or that Jesus will set the captive free. The first thought is, hey, I can get out of prison.

DAVID: Sure.

DON: Yeah they can, because that has happened too. But we are all captives. I mean these people had to be captives in prison for a crime. There are others though, who are captives to TV, or obesity, drugs, alcohol, all of the things of the world. So Isaiah is dealing with a package, and the price is cheap because he can set you free. Isaiah 61, The spirit of the Lord is upon you because the Lord has anointed me to preach good tidings. Well, people who listen to this say, well wait a minute. I'm not anointed to preach. Sure you are! We all are. If you understand God's Word, and put it into action. I had somebody say to me at a restaurant last night. "You're a Christian." I said, huh? And he said, "You just have that glow." I said, "Well praise the Lord."

DAVID: Which you do.

DON: And we were happy for it because Jesus did set me free. I was in every kind of experience you could be in. Drugs, alcohol, I had been in and out of prison.

DAVID: You served years yourself…

DON: And I have been straight and clean through the power that Isaiah talks about through this Word. People misread Bibles. Now Isaiah is a book that you really shouldn't, because there is so much meat there. I do enjoy the Spirit of God is upon me, because if it weren't for the spirit of God, I wouldn't have gone from Indiana to California. If it weren't for the Spirit of God I wouldn't have gone from the gutter to the kingdom of heaven, where I am one day soon going. But why did I get there? Because before the beginning of time, God saw me, He saw my predicament, and God gave me the choice of finding the New Testament, Old Testament, and the whole Bible.

DAVID: Right.

DON: And I like to hop between scriptures, and Isaiah leads you to the whole Bible.

DAVID: Let me ask you this Don? You have been right there in the hole, on death row, you have held hands with these men and women, boys, and girls who are in the very worst of it. They come to know Christ. They read Isaiah. They find freedom. They're still locked up, they may have fifteen more years to serve. But you have seen men and women feel free in prisons. That has been your experience.

DON: More than once, and I mean this so sincerely. There's an addiction that we all get. I got addicted to the Bible. I used to be an alcoholic, and when I quit and became a Christian, I used to go to AA meetings in San Francisco years ago; and this was a freedom that I was really set from. I was the guest key note speaker, and when you get up you say, my name is George, and I'm an alcoholic etc…When I got up as the keynote speaker I said, my name is Don, I'm a Christian. The blood of Jesus has set me free. I'm not an alcoholic anymore. I have never been invited back to AA since, but that's ok. Because Jesus can set you free from all kinds of addiction. And if you read and go through the book of Isaiah, and put yourself in each verse; like I can read this very simply. We need to preach good tidings to the poor. He has sent me to heal the broken hearted. Now God has done that to me, but to somebody else, if they put their own name in there. He can do that to them too.

DAVID: So it's not a platitude, it's not a Hallmark line. This verse is absolutely real, and you are there making it real.

DON: It's not just us. Yvonne and I do this because God wants us to do it.

DAVID: We were talking on the daily program about how so many prisoners are unjustly there, and that unfairness, the resentment they feel, the bitterness. They're losing years of their life. You have experienced this first hand with these folks; I'm sure many times. Does the gospel, does the Isaiah message, help them to deal with the unfairness, to give that to God and to turn it over to Him? And live now in emotional freedom in prison?

DON: Once they learn how to study…now one of the nice things I wish Voice of Prophecy, and this lesson went into every cell. But those cells it's going into today, take the book of Isaiah and dissect it. I mean just dissect it, and make it part of your life. Believe and receive. Believe that God is going to act. Believe that God said, "I'm going to set you free." Now that freedom can be freedom in your cell, or outside.

DAVID: Sure. Thank you so much Don.

CONNIE: That was the Good News Singers with the song "Change My Heart O God, following up on David Smith's interview with Don McClure, who has seen a lot of hearts changed as a result of his ministry in prisons all over this nation.

LONNIE: Not the least of which was his own heart--which saw a drastic change. Because Don himself did some hard time in prison before becoming a Christian and beginning his ministry. I've spoken with Don many times for our daily broadcast, and he always has thrilling stories about how the "Someone Cares" ministry is changing lives. And the really great thing about this ministry is that they invite people to get involved in ministering to prisoners from their own homes, in ways that are perfectly safe and secure.

CONNIE: If you'd like more information about "Someone Cares," grab a pencil and jot down this information: They have a web page at SOMEONECARES.ORG, or you can call them at (812) 342-2932.

LONNIE: We really encourage our listeners to get involved with this great ministry to prisoners in a totally risk-free way, so let's give that number again: (812) 342-2932 to contact Don and Yvonne McClure at the "Someone Cares" prison ministry.

CONNIE: We like it when you contact us, too, so while you've got your pencil in hand, jot down our number too--that's 1-800-872-0055. And you can use that number to call and enroll in our Discover Bible course, or in our new Prophecy Bible course.

LONNIE: Over the next several months we'll be delving into the writings of each of the Old Testament prophets, so now would be a great time to enroll in this course that gives an overview of some of the most important prophecies in the Bible. The lessons come in the mail, or you can study them online at our web page, VOP.COM.

CONNIE: It's totally free, whether you take the course by correspondence, or by enrolling online, so take a moment and enroll today. But first, let's listen to Lonnie's message for today: Isaiah--Hope in the Ashes.

Isaiah--Hope in the Ashes

The year: 739 BC. The place: Jerusalem in the kingdom of Judah. The situation: a nation in distress. On the northern frontier, the larger kingdoms of Syria and Israel have formed a coalition, and are planning an attack on Judah. And to the north of them, the powerful Assyrian king Tiglath Pileser is rampaging about, destroying fortresses, deporting whole nations, and threatening to move southward at any time to confront Judah's southern neighbor, Egypt.

But that wasn't what riveted Isaiah's attention. No, something much bigger--something with cosmic consequences was on his mind. Listen to his account of what happened, as recorded in Isaiah 6:1

In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple (NKJV).
The vision made a deep impression on Isaiah, especially because of just when it was given: The year of King Uzziah's death.
Do you remember your Bible history? Do you by any chance remember just how Uzziah died?

Here's the story, from 2 Chronicles 26:16: "But when [Uzziah] was strong his heart was lifted up, to his destruction, for he transgressed against the LORD his God by entering the temple of the LORD to burn incense" (NKJV).
Uzziah entered the temple of the Lord--territory that was supposed to be reserved only for sanctified priests--and as a result, the Lord struck him with leprosy. He had to turn over the throne to his son. Eventually he died of the leprosy that resulted from his failing to respect the holiness of God.

No wonder Isaiah was startled--even frightened--when he found himself standing in the temple of the Lord--and not just the temple in Jerusalem, but God's temple--His throne room--in heaven! " 'Woe is me,' " he cried out. " 'For I am ruined! Because I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips; for my eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts' " (Isaiah 6:5, NASB).

Isaiah served the Lord, and spoke for the Lord, but it seems that the last thing he wanted that day was to be hauled into the very presence of God. He knew he wasn't holy enough to be there, and he feared for his life--with good cause, considering what had happened to King Uzziah.

But God ministered His grace to Isaiah. Notice what happened next: "Then one of the seraphim flew to me, having in his hand a live coal which he had taken with the tongs from the altar. And he touched my mouth with it, and said: 'Behold, this has touched your lips; your iniquity is taken away, and your sin purged' " (Isaiah 6:6,7, NKJV).
Isaiah had no right to be in the heavenly temple--any more than King Uzziah had had the right be in the temple in Jerusalem. But God Himself had invited Isaiah there--at least in vision. And so, instead of striking him with leprosy, an angel offered Isaiah what he needed in order to stand in the presence of a holy God: Cleansing--forgiveness--purging.
Isaiah came away from his encounter with God with something very different from what Uzziah received. Because Isaiah responded to God with humility, while King Uzziah had gone into the temple with defiant pride.

Uzziah received a death sentence.
Isaiah received a life sentence.
Isaiah was given the opportunity to live out his life as God's spokesman, to bring messages from the Lord to His people.
It wouldn't be an easy task, because most of the people didn't really want to hear God's word. They were content with the way things were, and didn't want to be challenged to follow God's ways more closely.

Still Isaiah appealed to them, in the poignant words we know from chapter 1, verse 18: " 'Come now, and let us reason together,' says the LORD, 'Though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they are red like crimson, they shall be as wool.' "

The Lord came to His people, offering the same sort of blessing He gave to Isaiah. "Sure, you're sinful," He says. "But I have a cure for that. You can be cleansed just like Isaiah was, if you'll come to Me. Here's how you can do it: " 'Wash yourselves, make yourselves clean; put away the evil of your doings from before My eyes. Cease to do evil, learn to do good; seek justice, rebuke the oppressor; defend the fatherless, plead for the widow' " (Isaiah 1:16, 17, NKJV).

This theme is repeated over and over throughout Isaiah's prophecy. Much of the book consists of descriptions of the dire consequences of failure to respond in humility to God. And when the question of what God really wants from His people comes up, Isaiah often decries the injustice and lack of love that runs rampant in the land. "Your rulers are rebels, and companions of thieves; everyone loves a bribe, and chases after rewards. They do not defend the orphan, nor does the widow's plea come before them" he says in 1:23 [NASB].

" 'What do you mean by crushing My people, and grinding the face of the poor?' " he asks in 3:15 [NASB].

"Woe to those who enact evil statutes, and to those who constantly record unjust decisions, so as to deprive the needy of justice, and rob the poor of My people of {their} rights, in order that widows may be their spoil, and that they may plunder the orphans," he proclaims in 10:1-2 [NASB].

Yes, a lot of the book of Isaiah consists of proclamations of woe upon the people, because of the injustice in the land.

And what makes this especially significant is the fact that Isaiah lived through one of the greatest religious reformations in the history of the kingdom of Judah--in the days of Good King Hezekiah. But even though the people in those days returned to "church" as it were--and celebrated great Passover feasts, Isaiah saw through the religious veneer to the rough underside of their lives. And he never ceased calling people to the kind of genuine heart religion that would demonstrate itself in justice and love to the downtrodden.

" 'If you are willing and obedient, you shall eat the good of the land;' " he promised. " 'But if you refuse and rebel, you shall be devoured by the sword'; for the mouth of the LORD has spoken" (Isaiah 1:19, 20, NKJV).

Unfortunately, Isaiah's messages of doom came true for most of the kingdom of Judah. At one point every fortified city in the country, except Jerusalem, was conquered by Assyrian armies. Thousands were devoured by the sword, and thousands more were sold into slavery.

But Isaiah also looked beyond the gloom and doom, to a better time. The last 27 chapters of the book look forward to a time when God would restore rather than tear down. They begin with these familiar words:

"Comfort ye, comfort ye my people, saith your God. Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the LORD's hand double for all her sins" (Isaiah 40:1, 2, KJV).
These verses are the prelude to the great promise of the coming of the Messiah--the words that John the Baptist quoted seven centuries later in the Judean wilderness: "The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God" (Isaiah 40:3, KJV).

Isaiah's message comes down to us today as well. The Lord still comes to us today, with His appeal: Come, let us reason together. The Lord still appeals to us to let Him wash us and make us clean. And He still cries out on behalf of the poor and downtrodden, pleading their case and asking us as Christians to be His representatives in helping them.
Won't you listen, and respond, as Del Delker sings these precious words from the throne room of our reasonable God: Come, let us reason together.